Christian Conservative Christian "Independent"

I'm an evangelical Christian, member of the CPC, but presently & unjustly exiled to wander the political wilderness.
All opinions expressed here are solely my own.

Thursday, April 03, 2008

Yuck

Dumb, dumb, DUMB... and yes, for the record, I do find the remarks offensive.

The smart move?  For the sake of the Party, I think he should just walk away... there's no room for those kinds of opinions in Canadian politics.


UPDATE: Some folks think I've come out too strongly against Mr. Lukiwski. There's a reason for that. In the political realm, I get tagged as a "racist bigot" all the time... though of course, nothing could be further from the truth. Hence my strong reaction against any evidence of it in our midst... because we already have enough image problems on that front already.

All that being said, people have asked the question of forgiveness... can there be any for this MP? Of course there can be... and I think his quick response, without excuse making, may enable him to gain it. For example, there's NDP MP Bill Siksay, who was the one to raise this issue in the Commons... Lukiwski called him to personally apologize for the remarks. I'm looking for the quote, but Siksay said he accepted it and now considers the matter closed. On the other hand, Liberal MP Scott Brison hasn't... there are people form whom the apology just won't do.

In reading about this issue today, I think one of the best posts I saw was Jason Cherniak's... he could have made hay with this one, but instead, he offered some very reasoned and thoughtful points on forgiveness.

As such, I'll take more of a wait and see approach to what happens next. I think his apology was immediate and heartfelt, and many seem to agree. Do I still think he needs to walk away? I don't know now... again, let's wait and see. I think there does need to be some action take to protect the Party, perhaps moving him to the backbenches for a while will serve that purpose. But again, I think I'll wait and see.

Is this going to hurt us moving forward? I don't know... most of those who would have really been offended likely weren't going to vote for us anyway. So we're going to have to wait and see.

22 Comments:

  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 06:30:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Bruce from Cambridge said…

    Liberals have made simular such comments which are always ignored by our state broadcaster the CBC. This stuff was probably dug up and planted having been previously been made public years ago. Maybe it was Ralph Goodale behind it. Mr. Lukiwski has made a very sincere apology for bad comments made many years ago and his apology should be accepted and the matter closed.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 06:48:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    This happened 18 years ago. Guess what, racist jokes and the likes still make their rounds. Am I offended when I hear them... no. Why? Because I'm grown up and can tell the difference between real racism and humour.

    Leave it up the the parasites to try and impose today's standards on a generation ago humour. BTW, has anyone seen the video???? Is it all just here say about the content? Is it even first hand information or has it been filtered by the elite... to protect my virgin ears???

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 06:51:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Blue Magic said…

    He has to walk for the good of the party.

    Sure it was 16 years ago, but it came out today.

    It's just the way she goes.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 06:58:00 p.m. EDT, Blogger John R. Sutherland said…

    I'm not proud of everything that I said 17 years ago either. But we judge people on their present attitudes. The man has humbly apologized and has stated that the comments no longer represent his views (thank goodness!). He should keep his head down for a while, but resignation is unnecessary.

    John R. Sutherland

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 07:14:00 p.m. EDT, Blogger The Heretic said…

    This comment has been removed by the author.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 07:15:00 p.m. EDT, Blogger The Heretic said…

    If he truly is sorry for what he said back then and is embarrassed for the type of person he was then I'd say forgive and forget. I'd sure hate to be judged for some of the things I might have said or done 17 or 18 years ago, or even just 10 years ago. There are very few opinions I held a decade ago that I still hold today.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 07:48:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous May said…

    I agree; he must go. To all who say it was 16 years ago, Imagine if he had said the n-word discussing blacks rather then the f-word discussing gays. The impact is the same; the only difference is society began accepting racial equality in the 60s, so it is more entrenched in our minds then the more recent sexual preference equality (80s?). For the record I am heterosexual, but I understand racism when I see it. Yes the NDP and the liberals are disgustingly pathetic trying to dig up decades old dirt and they are trying to somehow pin this on Harper and the Conservative party (both of which are quite moderate, especially the Prime Minister): but that doesn’t change what was said. Goodbye Tom Lukiwski.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 08:58:00 p.m. EDT, Blogger Christian Conservative said…

    I actually saw the footage myself... and it's inexcusable. Those kinds of jokes just aren't funny.

    I also saw his appology... I was waiting for him to answer the question "Why did you say it?", but he didn't explain that.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 09:15:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Dave Hodson said…

    I just don't really care what he or anybody else said 16 years ago.

    I don't care if he used the n-word, the f-word, or any other politically incorrect or otherwise offensive words. I know my personal views on a lot of things have changed from 16 years ago. It's not like the guy was taped while murdering somebody. No crime was committed here. It's ancient history.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 09:48:00 p.m. EDT, Blogger Christian Conservative said…

    BUT... the big problem is that if he doesn't walk away, it'll hang around the CPC for a good long while.

    Actions like this have consequences... even 16 years later. It's really unfortunate for him, but I just don't see any other way around it.

    And I still don't see how something like that could be considered funny.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 09:50:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    CC...I'll bet there are lots of politicians tonight saying "I sure hope they don't find tapes of my comments at the parties."
    The comment does belong in the 'yuck' column but I don't think he should resign.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 09:59:00 p.m. EDT, Blogger Christian Conservative said…

    Like I said though, the problem is that if he doesn't resign, it's going to hang around our necks like an albatross.

    And I think deep down, he knows it.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 10:22:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    The comments themselves, are they accurate or does this matter in a politically correct hellhole like Canada? (real conservative)

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 10:28:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous May said…

    As I've said, I think Tom Lukiwski should go, but Brad Wall should be okay. As I understand it, he was making fun of one person in a distasteful way, but that's not the same as making a bigoted comment about a whole race. (I haven't seen his part in the movie, I don't know where it is and frankly the whole movie is too boring to watch). He'll be in trouble for a few days and it will blow over. The movie is mostly lame silliness, frequent use of the (four letter) f-word and absolutely horrendous hair and clothes and glasses. Ugh! The 90s eh!

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 10:57:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    "I was waiting for him to answer the question "Why did you say it?", but he didn't explain that." -- yes, I think one of the pundits also seemed to want him to explain why he said it. You know -- I'll bet he doesn't even know why he said it. I think he probably said it because he had too much to drink and thought his friends would find him amusing. Lots of people say things they do not mean in an effort to gain attention. Ever done anything stupid? Can you explain why you did something stupid -- not usually. Time to move on. I don't think we need a public shaming over this -- which essentially seems to be what some are calling for.

     
  • At Thu. Apr. 03, 11:14:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    Were either of these two men in Government or even a member of a party at the time?

     
  • At Fri. Apr. 04, 07:40:00 a.m. EDT, Anonymous Dave Hodson said…

    May, you're saying that Brad is OK but calling for Tom to go. However, by what moral standards do you judge the words of one to be worse than the other? Once we start applying such judgements, we're treading into dangerous territory. Disgusting or not, we do have free speech, and no crime was committed. I'm not going to defend the words of either of them, but I will defend their right to say it. But all that aside, I can't get over the fact that it's ancient history, and I will not condemn someone for words they said in a different era, when the politically correct rules surrounding this were different.

    CC, I understand what you're saying, in that it could hurt future electoral chances. But, I'm not a Liberal who's only goal is to try to win an election at any cost. The guy said he's sorry, said he doesn't hold those views now, and after 16 years, I believe him. I won't dump someone just because it's politically convenient.

     
  • At Fri. Apr. 04, 08:21:00 a.m. EDT, Anonymous Blue Magic said…

    Dave Hodson says..

    "I understand what you're saying, in that it could hurt future electoral chances. But, I'm not a Liberal who's only goal is to try to win an election at any cost. The guy said he's sorry, said he doesn't hold those views now, and after 16 years, I believe him. I won't dump someone just because it's politically convenient."

    That's a very good point. But get ready to see this video played over and over again during an election.

     
  • At Fri. Apr. 04, 12:50:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    Hmmm, this is a tough one for me.

    As a gay man and a conservative who has been active in election campaigns, I find the remarks deeply offensive.

    But, yes, it was 16 years ago. He has apologised quickly. I can appreciate that.
    However, he should be reprimanded by the PM nonetheless and go to the backbenches. It would be a symbolic move.

    I understand that this was said at a party during an election campaign. Campaigns are high pressure environments where people need to let release some steam sometimes. I'm glad there is no tape of some of things I said about our political components during an election campaign. People say stupid things and possibly don't actually mean them.

    It's the view of one individual and not the party. But yes, it will come back during an election.

    What is more relevant to me are the views of people today.
    H.

     
  • At Fri. Apr. 04, 08:32:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Joe said…

    STOP APOLOGIZING LONG TIME AGO.

    The more you apologize the more it makes you look wrong even when you are right.

    If you made a comment 16 years ago that is no longer politically correct you don't apologize for it now, you tell your opponent to get stuffed.

     
  • At Sat. Apr. 05, 08:09:00 p.m. EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    CC...this comment was made in private. Actually the privacy of many people has been wronged here...NDP should be ashamed.

     
  • At Mon. Apr. 07, 01:16:00 p.m. EDT, Blogger zolton said…

    Those are the types of people that you guys vote for. Backwards crazy controlled tools.

     

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