Christian Conservative Christian "Independent"

I'm an evangelical Christian, member of the CPC, but presently & unjustly exiled to wander the political wilderness.
All opinions expressed here are solely my own.

Thursday, August 10, 2006

Bush: 'Islamic fascists'

I've heard the term used over and over again in the Blogosphere, but I've NEVER heard any world leader use it in public... George W. Bush, in his press conference regarding the terror arrests in Britian, said of those who planned these attacks, "this nation is at war with Islamic fascists."

Glad to see that someone understands what's going on.

Some will say that US policies are responsible for all this, including 9/11. Those who say that forget that these attacks occured BEFORE any invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan... these terrorists are escalating the conflict by retaliating against the US response.

These radicals started it... do you expect the West to simply roll over and take it? Of course, the true Christian response would be just that... "turn the other cheek". Of course, there are no "Christian" nations on earth, so don't be surprised at the response. (No, America is NOT a "Christian" nation)

24 Comments:

  • At Thu Aug 10, 06:59:00 PM EDT, Blogger Ahmedinajad said…

    ISLAM IS THE RELIGION OF ABRAHAM, MOSES, JESUS AND MUHAMMAD (PEACE BE UPON THEM ALL). WAKE UP FEAR THE GOD OF ISRAEL AND THE UNIVERSE. AS A WESTENER THE RATE OF ISLAMS INFLUENCE IS SKY ROCKETING ESPECIALLY IN EUROPE. SO STOP BURYING YOUR HEADS IN THE SAND (no pun intended) LIKE OSTRICHES.

    Visit the following websites for further information on ISLAM.

    http://www.islamicity.com/Mosque/Muhammad_Bible.HTM
    (MUHAMMAD IN THE BIBLE)
    http://bible.islamicweb.com/
    http://news.sky.com/skynews/video/videoplayer/0,,31200-galloway_060806,00.html
    http://ifamericansknew.com/
    http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Books/MB_BQS/default.htm (Quran and Science)
    http://www.harunyahya.com/
    http://www.barnabas.net/
    http://www.answering-christianity.com/ac.htm
    http://www.islamicity.com/
    http://www.islamonline.net/english/index.shtml
    http://www.islamalways.com/

     
  • At Thu Aug 10, 08:41:00 PM EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    Is this supposed to be an attempt at Muslim evangelism? I thought Islam could only be spread by the sword?

     
  • At Thu Aug 10, 08:54:00 PM EDT, Blogger Christian Conservative said…

    Anonymous, there are young western kids converting in North America and Europe, so your comment is innacurate.

    I'm sorry Ahmedinajad, but I disagree with you on several points. I believe that the LORD God made His promises to

    Abraham via Issac, not Ishmael.

    God did, however, make a promise to Abraham that He would also bless Ishmael... granting him and his

    children most of the land in the Middle East... EXCEPT the area that Israel now occupies. If Muslims only

    gave up their claims to the land of Israel, which was never promised to them, there could be peace.

    As for the "path to God", I believe that the Lord Jesus alone is the true way.

    You're right on one count... the influence of Islam is growing significantly in Europe. Most people are

    only starting to notice... perhaps to late to do anything to stop it.

     
  • At Thu Aug 10, 09:11:00 PM EDT, Blogger Dirk said…

    Those who say that US policies are responsible for the general Arab mistrust of the US, and in the case of the Islamic facists (an appropriate term, I agree), a terror-based response to the US and the West, are talking about far more than just Iraq and Afganistan.

    You tell me if the following actions by Britain, France, and the US wouldn't cause you to be at least a little upset if you were an Arab.

    - The post-WWI carving up the Arab peninsula, and handing of control to favoured Arab families, who proceeded to act as tyrannical dictators who used their countries and people to enrich themselves.

    - The overthrow of a democratically elected government in Iran in the 1950s by the CIA, and the installation of the Shah, a tyrannical dictator.

    - The continued support by the US and the West of ruling families (ie. the House of Saud), who continue to control their countries in the same manner as Saddam Hussein ruled Iraq.

    So, even without talking about Israel, which I'm too tired to get into, your everyday Arabs have plenty of reasons to be pissed at the West. Although we go on and on about freedom and democracy, the powers that be clearly don't give a crap about the average Arab citizen. Our governments continue to placate and stroke leaders of the oil-rich Arab countries, meanwhile ignoring the human suffering they're responsible for.

    Disclaimer:
    I'm not saying that any of this justifies the terrorist acts we've seen. I'm just saying that when people get desperate, it's easy for religious freaks to get airtime and influence.
    It's foolish to assume that we've got all these angry Muslims in the world just because "they hate our freedom" or that they, as some say, have a violent religion that can "only be spread by the sword". This stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.

     
  • At Thu Aug 10, 11:44:00 PM EDT, Blogger ferrethouse said…

    Grow up Dirk. I guess we could be sympathetic if native Canadians started offing the whities.

    These muslims are cutting our heads off because we are white Christians not because something happened before most of them were born.

    Some people just don't get it!!!

     
  • At Thu Aug 10, 11:56:00 PM EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    Finally the leaders are getting around to identifying the problem. It's about time.

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 08:18:00 AM EDT, Anonymous drew said…

    I'd say that to name one reason for the terrorism is simply foolish. Yes, the Arabs have every reason to be upset at the US for what they did in Iran and other countries over there in the past, and that will be part of the justification the terrorists will use for their attacks. But their religion does cause them to look down on those of other religions too (and what religion doesn't? Christianity has proven itself horrible in that regard). So mix a persecution complex and political anger with religious beliefs that both tell them their religion is superior and that they should/will inherit the earth, add some religious leaders who believe violence will help (hmmm... this all sounds familiar) and you've got what we've got today. And of course even that is over-simplifying the case, I'm sure there are even more reasons for their attacks as well.

    All that said, the so-called "War on Terror" can't be won any more than the "War on Drugs" or "War on Crime" can be. We will always have all three among us, at least until Christ returns.

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 08:20:00 AM EDT, Anonymous drew said…

    "ISLAM IS THE RELIGION OF ABRAHAM, MOSES, JESUS AND MUHAMMAD (PEACE BE UPON THEM ALL). WAKE UP FEAR THE GOD OF ISRAEL AND THE UNIVERSE. AS A WESTENER THE RATE OF ISLAMS INFLUENCE IS SKY ROCKETING ESPECIALLY IN EUROPE. SO STOP BURYING YOUR HEADS IN THE SAND (no pun intended) LIKE OSTRICHES.

    Visit the following websites for further information on ISLAM..."

    Some other interesting websites on the subject include:

    - Jihad Watch
    - Dhimmi Watch

    :)

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 09:45:00 AM EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    CC,

    Those who agree with Mr. Bush forget the 9/11 happened AFTER
    1) The first Gulf war
    2) The Iran Crisis
    3) The creation of the Nation of Isreal on what was previously Muslim Lands
    4) Numerous wars between Isreal (supported by the U.S.) and it's neighbours
    5) The U.S. started supporting repressive regime's, simply to get their oil.
    6) U.S. interference in Afghanistan during the 1980's
    7) U.S. ignorance of local issue's as they instead have only an interest in enhancing their own power and influence (originally to counter the growth of the Soviet Union and now to maintain it's power).

    Who started this conflict??? It's been tit-for-tat for years, but if you read the bible, you'll realize that when Joshua lead the Isrealite's into Isreal, they had to defeat the Palentinian's to get their land... the fact that they failed to kill them all off (as ordered by God), it was forcast that there will always be conflict between the Jews and the Palestinian's...

    This implies to me that the Palestinian's were actually there first and the current conflicts are exactly what God predicts would happen in the bible...

    The existance of terrorism, such as 9/11 and the recent scare's in Canada and England are just the extension of a centuries-old conflict where neither side is right or wrong...

    Hence support of the current conflict doesn't come down to who's right and who's wrong (as Mr. Bush love's to frame his arguments), but instead come's down to whether or not you believe that the ability to enforce your opinion equals the right to do so!

    Mike

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 11:39:00 AM EDT, Blogger Christian Conservative said…

    Mike, you said "3) The creation of the Nation of Isreal on what was previously Muslim Lands" and "but if you read the bible, you'll realize that when Joshua lead the Isrealite's into Isreal, they had to defeat the Palestinian's to get their land..."

    There is much debate on this, but you've made one error that I see commonly made... equating the Palestinian's with the Biblical Phillistines. There is little record of any Palestinian people prior to the 1920's... and even if they were found to be the same group of people, their only valid claim would be to the Gaza strip, which was the ancient home of the Phillistines... the infamous Goliath hailed from the city of Gaza.

    As for that part of the Middle East being "Muslim land", I disagree. It belonged to the Jews up until 70 A.D., when the Romans finally scattered them. Since that day, there has always been a remnant of Jews there, and in 1948, the world (via the UN) reconstituted the nation.

    This world has always seen conflict over national borders, and it always will. Hans Island is a case in point, and believe it or not, there are still several unresolved border disputes between Canada and the United States, mostly in BC and the Atlantic provinces. It seems the UN hasn't had too much success in creating nations either. Don't forget that the UN, and the Leauge of Nations before it, has tried to carve up the world in various ways several times in various places. Prussia used to be a part of Germany, now it's in Poland. Poland, I don't think, even existed prior to 1920. Austria-Hungary was a single nation, now two, with areas of it's former territory parted out to other nations as well. Yugoslavia, of course, was a disaster of an idea, and now the borders have reverted back to their pre-WWI state. And Czechoslovakia wasn't too hot an idea either, as we now see two nations. Then there's Kashmier... just ask and Indian or Pakistani. Etc, etc, etc.

    Kinda rambled on there and went on a tangent... oh well. Hope you get my point... I believe that Israel has the strongest claim to the land, for Biblical and ancestry reasons. The claim that it belonged to the Palestinian people is a misnomer, a mistake often made because the British referred to the area of ancient Israel as "Palestine".

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 02:20:00 PM EDT, Blogger jdave34 said…

    Who had the land before 1948? Did they have a legitimate claim to it? Did they agree to give it up?

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 02:44:00 PM EDT, Anonymous Ryan said…

    The origin of the Philistines has been debated among scholars, but modern archaeology has suggested early cultural links with the Mycenean world in mainland Greece.

    The term "Palestine" derives from the word Philistine, the name of a non-Semitic ethnic group, who inhabited a smaller area on the southern coast, called Philistia, whose borders approximate the modern Gaza Strip. The larger area of what is now commonly called Isreal/Palestine was controled by the now non-existant ethnic group the Canaanites.

    In 132–135 BC the Roman emperor Hadrian expelled most Jews from Judea, leaving large Jewish populations in Samaria and the Galilee. He also changed the name of the Roman province of Judea (Israel) to Syria Palaestina named after the Philistines as an insult to the now conquered Jews.

    Muhammed came along in the 600's and founded Islam. Prior to the founding of Islam the Arab peoples had no well defined religion, they practiced various forms of mysticism and paganism and other quasi-semtic religious practices. There is no basis for the claimed relgious roots going back to Abraham. Other people claiming to be Prophets appeared in the Mideastern world at the time of Muhammad, such as Musailama al-Kazzab or Aswad Ansi, who both claimed to be prophets and both led ultimately unsuccessful military campaigns

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 03:15:00 PM EDT, Blogger Christian said…

    Ryan,

    Far be for me to rain on your parade, but if "there is no basis for the claimed religious roots going back to Abraham" for the Muslims, then the same is true for the Christians. They both adopted aspects of Judaism, and claimed to be the spiritual descendents of Abraham. In fact, much of Europe was also still Pagan when Mohamed walked the earth, particularly large sections of Germany and Scandinavia.

    If white Europeans can claim spiritual descent from Abraham, then so can Arab peoples - neither of whom have any Jewish blood.

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 03:54:00 PM EDT, Anonymous ryan said…

    Yeah I see your point. I guess I just veiw Christinaity more as the logical extension of Judaism rather than a departure in that white Europeans claim their spiritual decent to Abraham by way of the Jews. Christ was a Jew, Christ came first to the Jews, most of the early church fathers were Jews, Christ said that he was the completion of the Mosiac Law. On the other hand one of Muhammed's first acts was to massacre 800 Jews in front of their families. Also, I could be wrong but I don't believe that there was any paternal reverance toward Abraham on the part of the Arab peoples prior to Muhammed.

    Anyway in some respects I'd like to see Christianity look back more to its Jewish roots and drop some of the pagan commonalities it picked up along the way.

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 03:55:00 PM EDT, Blogger Christian Conservative said…

    "Christian", several good points there, thanks.

    Ryan, thanks for that history lesson, I didn't know several of those facts.

    jDave, prior to 1948, it was a hodge-podge of groups, including Arabs, Jews, and British soldiers. In 1948, there was opportunity for peaceful co-existance, but some Arab players wanted no peace, and did not want a further Jewish presence. Instead of peaceful co-existance, they chose violence. (check out the early Paul Newman flick called "Exodous", of course, a dramatic fictional account of it all)

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 04:26:00 PM EDT, Blogger jdave34 said…

    some Arab players wanted no peace, and did not want a further Jewish presence. Instead of peaceful co-existance, they chose violence.

    --But considering that the land was owned by these Arabs, wasn't it their right to say "No, we don't want them here and we're not giving them our land"? I often wonder how Canadians would react if thousands and thousands of one particular ethnic group were dropped in their neighbourhood. I don't need to wonder how Canadians would react if they were suddenly told that they had to give up a lot of their land to these new arrivals.

    Why were the Palestinians made to compensate the Jewish people for Germany's crimes?

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 04:40:00 PM EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    the canadians do... it's called the french.

    lol

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 05:27:00 PM EDT, Blogger meghan said…

    Because no-one else would take them! Let's not forget that we are talking about people here, not homeless dogs wandering around begging for table scraps. Let's also not forget that before the war started no-one would take them when they tried to escape from the countries who were growing more and more anti-Semitic. And lest we forget, this group did suffer as no other group has come close to suffering in the history of the world, and this was only 60-odd years ago. They were nearly anihlilated as a people, simply for being born. The way they were treated before, during and after the war was monstrous, horrific and catasrophic, and as far as I'm concerned Canada is as culpable for the holocaust as Hitler.

    After the war the Jewish people were ferreted off into refugee camps. No country, including Canada once again, wanted to take on the "burden" of this group of people. What better place for them to go but back to where they had come from before the dispersion in 70 AD? There were already some Hebrew people living there and in relative harmony with their Arab and Christian neighbours. The ones who caused the trouble after the land was granted to Israel were largely Nazis working in league with Mullah's from other Arab nations.

    Israel has been hated by the world since God chose her to be His people. The bottom line is that someday they will have the land--all of it--without contention. That will be at an appointed time that God alone knows. Until then they will be faced with conflict and turmoil. They have a right to a homeland, and a right to defend that homeland as any other nation would do.

    For all the bickering going on about who's right or wrong in the particular conflict occurring right now, I'd like to know what those who oppose Israel's actions suggest they do? Should they say, oh, sorry, we'll stop bombing you now, we'll stop defending ourselves, and hey, you know what, why don't you just come and take over our land? Yeah, you can rape our women, kill our children and sterilize our men! Hey, we could be your slaves!!! Sound fair to you?

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 05:51:00 PM EDT, Blogger Christian Conservative said…

    jDave you said, "But considering that the land was owned by these Arabs, wasn't it their right to say "No, we don't want them here and we're not giving them our land"? I often wonder how Canadians would react if thousands and thousands of one particular ethnic group were dropped in their neighbourhood. I don't need to wonder how Canadians would react if they were suddenly told that they had to give up a lot of their land to these new arrivals."

    Intersting thought... care to take the basis of your point and apply it to Caledonia? Or to Canada as a whole?

    Do you propose that we give it ALL back? I certainly don't... but some sort of arrangement can surely be made.

    So my point is this... Israel is there now, and is not going anywhere anytime soon. But some of their neighbours, wronged in tha past or not, want nothing more than to "wipe Israel off the map". (according to a lovely little Hezbollah bilboard in Lebanon)

    So what are we going to do about it? Anyone? Buler?

     
  • At Fri Aug 11, 07:08:00 PM EDT, Anonymous Ryan said…

    "But considering that the land was owned by these Arabs, wasn't it their right to say "No, we don't want them here and we're not giving them our land"?

    The Jews in "Palestine" increased from 11% of the population in 1922 to 30% by 1940. 28% of the land was already bought and owned by Jews.

    By 1947, violence had escilated between Jews and Arabs and things seemed unreconcilable. The UN General Assembly approved the 1947 UN Partition Plan dividing the territory into two states, with the Jewish area consisting of roughly 55% of the land, and the Arab area roughly 45%. Jerusalem was planned to be an international region administered by the UN to avoid conflict over its status.

    David Ben-Gurion accepted the partition deal, but the Arab League rejected it. Widespread fighting between Arabs and Jews erupted, and triggered the first phase of the 1948 War of Independence.

    "I don't need to wonder how Canadians would react if they were suddenly told that they had to give up a lot of their land to these new arrivals"

    You know I see your point here, but please name a country that didn't come into being by conquering the peoples who previously occupied the land.

    I guess maybe Japan would count (although they had plenty of internal battles between states) Is there another?

    The fact that for most Western countries our formation was many generations into the past doesn't make our origins any more noble than Isreal's 58 years.

     
  • At Sat Aug 12, 01:22:00 PM EDT, Anonymous ryan said…

    Just a correction to an earlier post of mine.

    The Roman Emperor Hadrian renamed the Roman province of Judea- Syria Palaestina in 135 AD after the Romans recaptured isreal following the short lived success of the Bar Kokhba revolt.

     
  • At Sat Aug 12, 01:39:00 PM EDT, Anonymous ryan said…

    AD not BC

     
  • At Sat Aug 12, 04:36:00 PM EDT, Anonymous Anonymous said…

    Thankfully America isnt a fully Christian country, its bad enough as it is

     
  • At Sat Aug 12, 06:58:00 PM EDT, Anonymous drew said…

    "Thankfully America isnt a fully Christian country, its bad enough as it is"

    LOL. That goes for Canada too. God, please save us from your followers. :D

     

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